3/24/09 Presentation to Parish Council

Total person-hours spent for 14 meetings, approximately: over 182 hours.

III. Rationale for Building a Social Center

The idea of building a social hall is not new and has been discussed by several committees in the last thirty years at St. Greg’s. The committee spent some time examining why building a social center is so important at this time.

A. Cited as a Major Goal of the Discernment Process

As previously mentioned, the building of a social center and the creation of a long-range plan for the parish were the highest ranking objectives of last year’s discernment process. The charge for our Committee came out of the Discernment process. The top seven priorities identified by the parish in the Listening Sessions, in order, included:

1) Build new building/social center

2) Develop a long-range plan for the parish

3) Fellowship and social aspects

4) Spiritual development and spiritual needs

5) Youth Ministry

6) Current building needs

7) Fundraising

The Parish Center project clearly addresses numbers 1, 2, 3, 5 and 7, and perhaps 6. In addition, the Parish Center will give us space to engage in the broad range of new activities that the Discernment process says we as a parish want. The Goals from phases two and three of the Discernment process, from the April general meeting in the gym, included:

1) Engage youth and keep them involved with the church

2) Continue to build community at St. Greg’s

3) Foster spiritual awakening, renewal and growth in the parish

4) Improve church communications and operations.

Numbers 1, 2 and 4 tie into the Parish Center. The October Parish Council meeting created this Committee to begin investigations, and the November Parish Council meeting confirmed these priorities. The events that will occur in the Parish Center will tie into these topics, certainly. Of course, what actually gets done relevant to the goals above depends on what we have for a Parish Center, too. It’s a bit of a chicken-and-egg problem, and that makes the issue more difficult to deal with.

B. Our Present Facilities Are Not Adequate

We currently have the use of three different sites for possible group gatherings: the church basement, the community room in the rectory, and the school gym. None of these sites can adequately accommodate parish needs.

The church basement has the great benefit of being convenient to the church for events that are related to our worship services. However, it is inaccessible for the elderly and those with handicaps. The addition of an elevator would be very costly and take up valuable space. The basement only seats about 80 people comfortably so it cannot accommodate larger meetings and events. There is also a lack of parking especially when the Church is also in use.

The community room is good for small meetings, but not for larger events. It also has problems with handicap accessibility and parking.

For some activities, we can use the gym…and do. For some activities, it works just fine. But the gym has some problems when we try to use it as a social hall. The obvious “gym” qualities (high ceilings, bleachers, backboards, scoreboard, etc.) are not quite conducive for wedding receptions, many parties, and other uses. Because it is a gym, the acoustics are very poor. It is too small for some activities, too big for others. (The gym is about 5,800 square feet and seats about 300 comfortably. The goal of seating 500 comfortably requires about 10,000 sq ft.). There is a lack of parking for big events. Finally, the gym is already used extensively especially by the school. (See Appendix B)

C. Other Considerations

1) The Parish Center could be the seed that sprouts more growth for the parish, and helps provide a long-term vision of who and what we can become. In part, there may be an “if you build it, they will come” effect. The events held at the Parish Center will bring new people into the building and into contact with our community, giving them a chance to see who we are. And projecting an image of new building may attract new members, and give inactive parishioners a reason to return.

2) If the parish gets behind this project and works collaboratively, it can help pull us together. Working together to build a community space can help create the community we seek. The shared struggle to make it happen will put us all on the same side, working for a common goal.

3) A success in this project will give us a “win” when we could surely use one, to take the taste of past

divisions out of our mouths. The new space may help give us a new self-image and show ourselves

(and outsiders) that we are past those bad old days and have come together as a parish, and can

complete a significant project in a cooperative manner.

4) St. Greg’s Parish may very well have an image problem in the minds of other parts of the Diocese, especially in the minds of priests, resulting from the nastiness of past battles over the previously-proposed new church. A bad reputation as a parish would put us at a serious disadvantage when/if we need to compete for a new priest in the future.

5) A Parish Center and a successful effort to do the work involved in making it happen may help insure our long-term viability as a parish. In the next few years, the Diocese of Erie will have to make some difficult decisions regarding the closing and merging of parishes. All of the dioceses surrounding the Diocese of Erie as well as all of the dioceses in Pennsylvania have already completed or are in the midst of these difficult decisions.

To prepare the diocese for this inevitability, the May 2008 issue of Faith magazine presented a special report entitled “Priesthood and Parishes in the Erie Diocese: What Does the Future Hold?” While no one knows for certain what the future will hold, it seems apparent from the experience of other dioceses that those parishes that were not viewed as “viable” were either closed or merged. Viability was judged by parish size, condition of parish buildings, vitality of parish life and ministry, active youth ministry, income, potential for future growth, etc. The Committee thinks that the existence of a social hall and a long range plan to create a unified campus will help demonstrate the viability of St. Greg’s parish and help secure its future in a world of disappearing parishes and increasing competition for priests.

IV. Potential Uses of the Parish Center

A. Parish Activities

Before the Committee could decide on the size needed for the parish center, it first considered what activities would be occurring there. The Committee invited parishioners at large, as well as several parish organizations to suggest ideas for how the Parish Center might be used. The result was an extensive listing of activities that would be possible to undertake that would enhance community life and growth if the parish had the right facility. A complete listing of these activities is in Appendix C. We believe these activities provide a substantial reason for building the Parish Center.

B. Generating Income by Rental Business

The Committee also looked into the possibility of generating income from the parish center by running it out when it is not needed for parish activities. Members of the Committee contacted several facilities in the area to learn if this was a viable possibility. A summary of these discussions is listed in Appendix D. The Committee concluded that trying to run a social hall as a profit-generating business is extremely difficult with volunteers. If the parish wants to pursue this it should consider contracting this aspect of the hall out to experts. The good news is that there are some models for us to work from on this. We expect that the parish center could generate some income for the parish, but this is only a side benefit and not the focus. We do NOT expect that the parish center could pay for itself in the near future based on rental business.

V. Building Specifications: What Will the Parish Center Include?

A. The Parish Center Building

The Committee thinks the Parish Center should include:

-A social hall (open, great hall) big enough for 500 adults, seated. (Rationale for this size is explained below.)

-A commercial kitchen equipped to handle a meal for at least 500

-Appropriate restroom facilities.

-Must be handicap accessible

-Meeting rooms for parish committees and religious purposes

-Parish offices. This would include offices for the main parish office (secretary), Pastor, Faith Formation, Pastoral Minister, Music Minister, Maintenance, and possibly: RCIA, Adult Formation, Youth, Finance/Counting Room, and others

-If the building has a basement, it would need to be accessible by those with disabilities. An elevator would cost about $20,000-$40,000 per floor (presumably for one floor) and about $3,000-$6,000 per year for a maintenance contract.

-A stage and sound system, and have good acoustics.

-Plenty of storage for tables, chairs, and the things that parish groups need to store.

-Smaller meeting/activity rooms for meetings of parish groups and youth ministry purposes. Some of these may be suitable for Faith Formation classrooms, too. Might we be able to partition a larger room or the social hall itself for this purpose?

-Parking for about 200 cars.

-Perhaps an outdoor pavilion and picnic space.

It is not clear if we need the Parish Center to accommodate Faith Formation classes. They would add significantly to the costs of construction We decided to price the Parish Center both ways, with and without classrooms. Faith Formation issues are discussed below.

The Committee is unanimous in thinking that the Parish Center should be adjacent to the church and school, preferably connected to them for ease of movement among the buildings of our complex. We do not expect this to happen immediately, but we think it should be part of the long-term plan.

B. How Big Should the Parish Center Be?

We gathered information from several sources to help us answer this question.

For purposes of comparison, the current gym is approximately 5,800 sq ft and seats approximately 300 comfortably.

Currently our largest events bring in over 300 people.

Casino Night (Feb 7, 2009) had between 400 and 450 people attend, although they were probably not all there at the same time. The gym was set up for 320 people for that event.

The Knights of Columbus’s Sports Raffle routinely attracts 700 -1,000 people. This event could not be held on our property in any case since it involves raffle of firearms and there is a Diocesan rule against doing that on Diocesan property. But the point is that the right events can attract quite large crowds, and having a larger social hall will allow us to do these kinds of events.

The original plans of the Building Committee called for a social hall facility of 6,110 sq ft at Brickyard Road, accommodating 250 people. Later Weber-Murphy-Fox plans called for 7,940 sq. ft. The attached gym was to be 9,782 sq ft and the social hall could opened into it for larger functions.

The 2007 Parish Center Committee, our predecessors, planned for 500 people when they gathered construction cost estimates.

We asked various parish organizations about what they might use a Parish Center for. These are presented in Appendix C. Several of the suggested activities would require a large great hall.

Evaluation of the comments from other parishes and halls (Appendix D) also leads us to think that 500 is a good size. We estimate that a building of 15,000 square feet would have room for the great hall as well as necessary parish offices.

C. Faith Formation

Should the Parish Center include room for all Faith Formation classes? Issues related to this are:

-If the Faith Formation classes are able to take place somewhere other than the Parish Center, the Parish Center building can be significantly smaller and less expensive.

-Currently, our Faith Formation classes are larger than our school can handle and a number of classes take place at Mercyhurst College. We do not currently have a facility large enough for all Faith Formation classes to occur simultaneously at the same place.

-How important is it for all the Faith Formation classes to take place in the same location?

-How important is it for all Faith Formation classes to take place at the same time? Currently classes for a number of the older students occur at different times.

-Do the Faith Formation classes need to take place in our own buildings, or is it okay for them to take place elsewhere? Is it important to the parish to have our students coming to our own buildings to build their sense of parish identity?

-Some options for Faith Formation classes:

-the new Parish Center

-the school

-Mercyhurst College

-North East School District buildings. As taxpayers, we can use these buildings for our meetings. Parishioner Jim Barnes is on the North East School Board and is willing to help with this option if we choose to pursue it.

The Parish Center Committee of 2007 compiled a list of the classroom needs of the Faith Formation program. At that time, the ideal situation which would allow all classes to meet at the same time was listed as 15 classrooms: one for 40 students for the confirmation class, two for 30 students (middle and high school classes), and 12 for 20 students (elementary school classes.) Our Committee discussed the fact that the FF students probably do NOT need to all meet at the same time. In fact, there may well be a preference on the part of the older students to meet later in the day or evening, rather than in the morning. Currently, FF classes are meeting:

K-4: School, Sunday AM

5-8: Mercyhurst, Sunday AM

9-10: Church basement, Sunday afternoon

Confirmation: Church basement, Sunday evening

Our FF and CCD programs have done different times for different classes for a long time. The problem appears to be the need to do two separate programs at two different places (the School and Mercyhurst) at the same time (Sunday AM). That’s inconvenient for some of the parents. There is also a preference for having the FF class on our own campus rather than elsewhere, to help tie the kids into our parish more.

VI. Land Needs

The Committee started by asking how much land we would need, first for the Parish Center, and second for the whole parish campus.

A. Immediate: The Parish Center Alone

A single-story 15,000 square foot Parish Center would cover about 0.34 acres just for the building, leaving no space around it. Adding another 15,000 square feet for a Faith Formation/classroom building would double that. A reasonable estimate might be 0.5 to 1.0 acres of land needed just for this part.

Parking for 200 cars will require inclusion of 25 handicap spots. Allowing 9’x18’ for regular spaces and 13’x18’ for handicap spaces would require a minimum of 0.76 acres, just for the parking spaces. We will obviously need aisles and ingress/egress space, and hopefully a bit more space than the bare minimum. We consulted three different articles with guidelines for parking, and they led us to think that we should allow 1.6 to 2.0 acres for parking; more if space is abundant.

If we’d like to have a picnic pavilion or playground at the Parish Center, then more space would be required. It would also be good to have extra outdoor space to allow spillover for Center events, such as a festival.

This suggests that we may be able to fit the Parish Center and its parking into a space of approximately two to three acres at a bare minimum, but it would probably be best to allow more room.

B. Long Term: Room for ALL Our Activities, Now and in the Future

The complete parish campus should allow room for the following.

-A school and/or Faith Formation classrooms. If there is a school, we will also need a gymnasium.

-A church, eventually

-A rectory (priest residence), perhaps. However, there may be a preference on the part of parish priests NOT to be next door to the parish complex, to give them some privacy and distance from work when they’re off. Since competition for priests will almost certainly be increasing in the future, it would be wise to consider this. The pastor’s house should probably have three bedrooms, a garage and a yard for gardening.

-Other things we may wish to consider in the future, for example, senior housing

-Parking for all these operations. One lot could be shared by several of our buildings, of course.

-Room to host larger events such as a festival, perhaps with the addition of a tent, and with extra field parking.

-Room to expand

Given all this, the Committee thought that it would be best if the site were at least seven to twelve acres.

VII. Construction Cost Estimate

A quick and reasonably accurate way to get initial estimates for construction costs is to use a per-square-foot cost, rather than trying to cost out individual components in detail. The Committee contacted Weber-Murphy-Fox Architects for an estimate of current costs. They recommended using the estimates from the “Reality Check” portion of the Building Committee’s plans for the previously proposed Brickyard Road complex, but increasing them by 20%. That results in estimated construction costs of:

-Parish Center: $108 per square foot + 6% for architect and engineering fee, or about $115 per square foot

-Parking: $840 per space

-Kitchen: $144 + 6% = approx $153 per sq ft (not including commercial kitchen equipment of about $180,000)

These numbers do not include land, landscaping, permitting costs, EPA or DEP and water/sewer work that might be necessary, furniture, etc. All systems (e.g., HVAC, plumbing, sound) are included.

For comparison:

2002 Building Committee estimates:

Social hall: $96 per square foot

Kitchen: $128 per square foot + $150,000 for equipment

Parking: $700 per space

2007 PC Committee: about $102 per square foot

Given this information, the Committee calculated the following construction cost estimates. NOTE: these are estimates to give us a general idea of the size of the numbers involved. The actual numbers won’t be known until we hire an architect and get bids. The table below shows that we estimate the construction costs for a Parish Center to be approximately $2.3 million. These costs will be approximately the same at any site, except the Ferraro Ford site which already has a building. For that site, we estimated the cost of renovating and adapting that building to our needs. These estimates are also included in the table below, and amount to about $880,000.

If we wish to have a Parish Center large enough for Faith Formation, it would require about another 15,000 square feet. This would add about $1.8 million to the cost of the project. The Ferraro building already includes about 24,000 square feet, so it would be necessary to add another 6,000 square feet to that building for classrooms and offices, with a cost of about $900,000.

VIII. Site Reports

The Committee started by asking what possible sites existed in the North East area for our future campus, reviewing those that previous parish committees had considered, as well as others that came to mind. We ultimately decided to consider five sites in depth, and these are presented in this section. They are, in alphabetical order:

-Brickyard Road, the property that we already own adjacent to the cemetery

-Ferraro Ford, on Route 20 west of town

-Main Street, the site of the school and rectory, on property we already own, with the possible addition of adjacent property

-Pearl Street, adjacent to the church

-Sunset Drive between Lake Street and Pearl Street, on land currently owned by Mercyhurst College.

Appendix E presents maps and pictures of these properties.

While the construction costs for the building and parking lot will be essentially the same at any of these sites (except for the Ferraro Ford site, which already has a building and a paved lot), some other aspects of the sites can make significant differences in the cost of building there. We endeavored to estimate these various costs at the five sites. The spreadsheet on the next page shows the costs for all five sites, side by side. For the Pearl Street site, there are three options, as explained below.

Characteristics of each site are explained below, along with assumptions we made in order to create the estimates. For each of the five sites we also created a list of positives and negatives, issues and concerns. We undoubtedly did not uncover every issue, but we tried our best to include the most important ones for each site. We expect open discussion by the parish to fill in any that we missed.

The table shows estimates in the following ranges:

Parish Center alone: $2.5 to $4.9 million

Parish Center and Faith Formation/Classrooms: $4.3 to $6.6 million.

A. Brickyard Road (Our Land Adjacent to the Cemetery)

The Brickyard Road site is on property that we currently own, east and south of the cemetery. It is currently leased and planted with grapes. This is, of course, the site that was widely discussed during the previous debates about building a new church. We own 41.5 acres at this site.

Positives

-This is the only site that can bring all aspects of the parish’s activities together, since it is adjacent to the cemetery. It will allow literally cradle-to-grave for parishioners.

-There is plenty of space for expansion—over 40 acres in total, the largest of any site.

-It is one of the least expensive options since we already own the land.

-There is great visibility from Route 20.

-Some site preparation work has already been completed.

-There should be few zoning issues since we already own the land.

-There are no existing buildings to bring up to code.

-Since there are no buildings on the site, there will be no need for demolition, removal or disposal.

-Relatively little landfill should be required.

-We can stay in our current buildings until completion if we so choose.

-The adjacent land can allow us to park on the grass when we need extra parking for various events, and allow pitching tents for larger events.

-It is closer to the population centers west of North East, which would be a positive for rental purposes.

-If the Diocese ultimately decided to combine St. Gregory and Our Lady of Mercy parishes, our new site would be a likely location.

-A new winery development will be occurring across Route 20 which will help bring water and sewer lines to the area. This can also tie into the rental business for the Parish Center and bring greater visibility to the parish campus generally.

-If we ultimately sell the Main Street and Pearl Street sites, that land would go back on the tax rolls of the Borough and County.

Negatives

-Until the whole campus is complete, we will have greater separation of the parish activities and buildings.

-It is not downtown; we will be moving out of the center of North East.

-It would not be walkable for parishioners.

-It is more subject to noise pollution from trains and traffic than some of the other sites.

-There may be up-front costs to extend the water line, depending on what happens with the winery project. If so, the initial costs could be significantly more than the amount listed for “Utility Connections” in the previous spreadsheet, perhaps $100,000 more. Some of these funds would be recouped as other landowners along the route connected to the water line.

-This site will probably require us to build our own sewage plant.

-There may be EPA and water runoff issues. Work on these issues was done and clearances won by the Building Committee previously, but the standards may have changed since then.

-This site is associated with one “side” in the previous debates over a new church, and there may be negativity associated with that.

-There may be a traffic issue related to Route 20. Traffic would enter and exit on Brickyard Road, but most would still need to get onto Route 20.

-There could be a zoning issue if we open a school here.

-Requires removal of current grape vines

Revenue Issues

-Main Street property can be sold eventually.

-Pearl Street property can be sold eventually.

-There would be a loss of income from current lease of the land.

-If we have to pay all the costs up front for extension of water and sewer lines, we will be reimbursed later as others tap into those lines.

B. Ferraro Ford (On Route 20 west of town)

The former Ferraro Ford property at 10093 West Main Street is for sale for $1.5 million. It includes 12.4 acres and a building with 24,300 square feet, currently configured as a car dealership and repair facility. We would need to reconfigure the interior of this building, adding walls and flooring, and adding air conditioning. We may need to upgrade the building to meet new code requirements. Construction cost estimates take account of these factors in place of the construction costs listed for a new building at the other sites.

Positives

-There is already a building on the site that could be adapted for our purposes. This may be the quickest of the options.

-The building is rather new.

-It is ADA compliant and wheelchair accessible.

-With relatively few changes we can have a Parish Center.

-A large part of the lot is already paved for parking.

-Very good visibility on Route 20.

-This site already has borough water.

-It is closer to the population centers west of North East, which would be a positive for rental purposes.

-If the Diocese ultimately decided to combine St. Gregory and Our Lady of Mercy parishes, our new site would be a likely location.

-A new winery development will be occurring down Route 20. This can tie into the rental business for the Parish Center and bring greater visibility to the parish campus generally.

-If we ultimately sell the Main Street and Pearl Street sites, that land would go back on the tax rolls of the Borough and County.

-No landfill should be required.

-There should be no zoning problems.

-It is a neutral site; not involved in the past debates about the site for a new church.

-Given the current economic situation, we may be able to acquire the property for significantly less than the $1.5 million asking price. We have nevertheless included that full asking price in the cost estimates for this site.

Negatives

-Traffic issues; ingress and egress from Route 20 may be problematic.

-Until the whole campus is complete, we will have greater separation of the parish activities and buildings.

-It is not downtown; we will be moving out of the center of North East.

-It would not be walkable for parishioners.

-It is more subject to noise pollution from trains and traffic than some of the other sites.

-This site may require us to build our own sewage plant or extend sewage lines.

-Can a church be built on the front part of the property?

-It will be necessary to do major renovations to adapt it to our purposes.

-We will be adapting a building that was not built for our specific purposes.

-Given that it was used for automotive repair, are there any issues with toxic wastes? We allowed $50,000 in the estimates for testing or remediation.

-No connection with our past.

-The lot is long and narrow and has rather small frontage on Route 20. Might this be a problem for arrangement of other buildings on the campus later?

-Despite the fact that the building is rather new, might there be significant costs for bringing it up to new codes?

Revenue Issues

-Main Street property can be sold eventually.

-Pearl Street property can be sold eventually.

-Brickyard Road property can be sold.

-There would be no a loss of income from current lease of the land.

-If we have to pay all the costs up front for extension of sewer lines, we will be reimbursed later as others tap into those lines.

C. Main Street (Current School and Rectory Site)

We own the land where the school and rectory are located, 10.6 acres including the athletic field. However Baker Creek runs through the property, separating the piece on Main Street from the field. This complicates the issue quite a bit due to DEP and EPA requirements. Previous committees determined that it would be prohibitively expensive to either tube the creek or build a bridge over it, so this Committee limited itself to considering the part of the site on Main Street south of the stream. The 2001 appraisal estimates the area south of the creek along Main Street at 3.52 acres, with 1.57 acres of “surplus land” along the creek that cannot be used or sold off, and 5.49 acres for the athletic field. We will focus on the 3.52 acres.

Work by previous committees determined that it might be possible to fit our complete complex here, although it would be very tight. Given the Committee’s evaluation of land needs (7-12 acres), we considered adding property near our current site to alleviate this problem. We considered:

-the former McKay Swift property across Main Street. Mr. Swift owns all five of the parcels on the north side of that block from Mill Street to West Street, and they have a total assessed value of about $610k for 2.37 acres.

-the Pennzoil property immediately west of our property, including a pole building and fence. This property includes 2.5 acres, part of which has the same stream problem that we already face. This property is assessed at $100,100. (That is not necessarily what it would cost us to acquire the property.) It has no frontage on Main Street, just a driveway. Committee contact with the current owners (Shell Oil) indicates that they may be willing to consider selling to us. (We are NOT considering the current Country Fair gas station and convenience store, nor the Pennzoil warehouse west of that.)

-the bowling alley west of the Pennzoil property. This property includes 1.6 acres and does not adjoin our current property, but adjoins the Pennzoil property. It is assessed at $311,200 and in September 2008 the owners were asking $600,000 for the property and business, with everything included. An ad hoc parish committee visited the site in September 2008. The building is about 16,000 square feet, but the committee decided that it is not very amenable to our needs for a social hall given its configuration as a bowling alley. (A full report on this property is available separately.)

Given these considerations, the Committee thought that it would be advisable to add the Pennzoil property in our evaluation of this site. We are unsure of what the acquisition costs would be for this property, but for other in-town sites we allowed double the assessed value as a possible purchase price. Applying that here leads to a potential price of $200,000. It is very possible that the acquisition cost would be significantly less than that, but we would need to be very careful about toxic waste and other environmental issues if we consider this property. This property also provides a link to the bowling alley property, should we eventually wish to expand farther to the west. Even with the Pennzoil property, the site would only include 5.5 - 6.0 acres of usable land, which would be crowded for our campus.

It may or may not be necessary to demolish the current rectory when we build the Parish Center. For the estimated costs above, we assumed that the rectory would not be demolished. If we move the church to this site, presumably the rectory would need to be demolished.

Positives

-Brings the school, rectory and parish center together quickly.

-One of the lower cost options since we already own most of the land.

-The Parish Center would be accessible to the school and vice versa. The school would have access to the parish center’s hall and rooms.

-Might it be possible to actually connect the parish center to the gym to allow an even larger space for selected events?

-This site would give the parish high visibility in the community.

-We already own most of the land necessary for this option.

-There should be relatively few zoning issues since we already own the land.

-It is a neutral site; not involved in the past debates about the site for a new church.

-Water and sewer lines are already available here.

-Walkable distance for some of our parishioners.

-It is downtown; we maintain a presence in North East.

-Faith Formation could continue to use the school classrooms, so we might need to build fewer classrooms to accommodate our Faith Formation needs on one site.

Negatives

-The current school building has maintenance and code issues.

-We would essentially pave over most of the land here, and it would not be as aesthetically appealing as some of the other sites.

-There would be very limited space for expansion.

-Parking would be tight.

-There may be traffic issues here.

-If we buy the Pennzoil property, there may be EPA or DEP issues. Are there toxic waste problems associated with this site? We allowed $50,000 in the estimates for evaluation or remediation.

-There would probably be major issues related to storm water runoff since we would be paving so much land adjacent to the creek.

-Might there be potential conflicts with the school over use of the hall?

-Depending on the final layout of the campus, the parking lot might be quite removed from the Parish Center and/or other buildings. This is due to the limited space at this site.

-Is not adjacent to the cemetery and cannot allow the cradle-to-grave continuum.

Revenue Issues

-We would be using valuable downtown land, which would cost us more than more remote land. (That is, if we use this land we can’t sell it.)

-We could sell the Brickyard property.

-Pearl Street property can be sold eventually.

-No loss of income from leased land on Brickyard Road

What is the Value of the Main Street Property?

An appraisal done in March 2001 by Erie Appraisal Associates, Inc estimated the market value of this parcel at $846,000, assuming that the 3.5 acres along Main Street could be rezoned from R-B Multifamily to C-1 Commercial, which is what the parcels on either side of our property and those across the street are currently zoned. The 5.49 acres of the athletic field are currently zoned R-A Single Family Residential. Given changes in market conditions since 2001, the current market value is likely to be different from that value.

The Committee thought it would be useful to consider surrounding properties on Main Street.

-The CVS property east of us is actually seven lots totaling 1.76 acres. That property sold on 11/9/00 for $2.9 million. It is assessed at $741,700.

-The Country Fair gas station/convenience store just west of us is on a parcel of approximately 0.8 acres, and sold on 12/6/08 for $1.98 million for the land and business. It is assessed at $176,500.

-The Pennzoil pole building property just west of us is 2.5 acres with no frontage on Main Street except a driveway. It is assessed at $100,100 with the building.

-The warehouse building west of the gas station is on 0.59 acres and is assessed at $143,400.

-The bowling alley property is 1.6 acres and is assessed at $311,200 with the building.

The Committee thought that the implication is that frontage on Main Street is quite valuable, since the zoning board appears to resist changing residential property along Main Street into commercial property. But it is very difficult to determine the actual value without actually selling the property. For example, it is entirely possible that the CVS property is no longer worth anything like the value they paid for it in 2000. We note that the former McKay-Swift property across the street is expected to go on the market soon, and this will give us a better idea of the actual value of our property here.

D. Pearl Street (Site of the Church)

The Pearl Street site is the most complicated for evaluation since the whole block is built up, and acquiring land there will be challenging. The whole block with the church contains 25 parcels on about 4¼ acres. Even if we bought the whole block, we would still have less than an optimal size for our campus. We currently own two adjoining parcels here totaling 0.72 acres (0.5341 for the church and south lot, and 0.1901 for the lot on Lake Street.)

We considered three possible approaches:

-purchase of the properties north of the church, eight properties totaling 1.39 acres. (On the map in Appendix E, they are properties numbered 1-6, 23 and 24).

-purchase of some properties south of the church, seven properties totaling 1.19 acres. (On the map in Appendix E, they are properties numbered 8-11 and 19-21. These go down to, but do not include, Fuller Hose Company.)

-purchase of all the properties included the options above, fifteen properties totaling 2.57 acres.

We did not consider properties across Pearl Street, although this might be another option. We would expect prices to be in approximately the same range. The block west of the church faces another problem in that there is a creek that runs through that block, raising possible problems about building in a flood zone. We would also have traffic safety issues since a street would run through our campus, although perhaps these could be dealt with.

If we choose to pursue this route, it will be necessary to have an agent set up an “all or nothing” deal with the neighbors, in which we would buy the properties ONLY if all agreed to sell. It is not clear if all the neighbors would be willing to give up their homes, and how high a price would be necessary to induce them to sell. In preliminary investigations the 2007 Parish Center Committee asked some of our neighbors on Pearl Street what kinds of prices they would ask for their properties. Their average asking price was about 175% of assessed value. Once it’s known that we want to expand at Pearl Street, the current owners may decide to hold out for high prices. In creating estimates of land acquisition at Pearl Street, we used 200% of assessed value as an estimate. True costs may well be higher or lower, and a few holdouts may make this site very difficult, if not impossible.

Since this site is already developed, it faces the additional cost of demolition and landfill for existing buildings. It is possible that this operation will also raise environmental issues if there are hazardous materials in those buildings, such as asbestos. We estimated the costs of demolition at about $7,000 per property.

Given that land is at a premium on Pearl Street, might it be possible to build a Parish Center here on less land by building a two-story center or a building that uses a basement and first floor? Those who were on last year’s committee had discussed the possibility of a two-story building at that time and did not remember significant savings since structural members have to be much stronger, and you lose space to stairs and/or elevators. The goal of a “great hall” means that we cannot reduce the basic floor space significantly. And we may have handicap-access problems with other levels, although these may be solvable by inclusion of an elevator, which would again add to initial and maintenance costs.

Positives:

-Historical roots. We continue our tradition and history in the place that so many people associate with St. Gregory Parish.

-It is in town; we maintain a presence in the center of things.

-We already have a church here, and we can keep it where it is. We may have to update, expand or improve it, but we won’t need to start from scratch.

-We can have the church and the Parish Center on the same campus right away, and use the PC for activities related to our religious services such as fellowship meetings after mass, dinners after funerals, First Communion breakfasts, etc.) At all other sites, we will have separation of the PC from the church for a long period of time.

-It’s in town and close for current walkers.

-It’s on Route 89, easy to find and more visible than some sites might be. (We can put a sign on the Route 89 side to increase our visibility.)

-Water and sewer lines already connect to the site.

Negatives:

-This site is the highest cost site, perhaps double the cost of other sites.

-There is a serious problem with space. There is not enough land here to do what we want in the future, to bring all the parish buildings together, let alone for future expansion. The whole block, with ALL properties, amounts to 4.24 acres. We own 0.72 acres currently, with the church and the parking lots. This site has much less than the 7-12 acres that we seek.

-It will be very costly to get the properties, if we can get them at all. We anticipate a cost in the range of $1.1 to $2.3 million just for land acquisition, much more expensive than at the other sites, and this would still not give us as much land as we need. Our cost here will probably be somewhere between $400,000 and $1,000,000 per acre with the cost of buying the houses.

-We’ll need to set up some kind of system in which “all” the neighbors have to agree to sell, or the whole project is off. Any one of our neighbors may be able to veto the project, as a result. This will make the whole project more tentative until the land is acquired. We will need to have a fully viable “Plan B” to avoid being held for exorbitant amounts by one or two landowners.

-There will need to be demolition of existing housing. That will be expensive, as well as being a bit wasteful from the bigger perspective.

-There may be possible problems with landfill for basements of houses we demolish.

-There may be possible DEP/EPA problems, e.g., asbestos or other polluting materials in existing houses.

-We’ll need to have the property rezoned to allow our proposed use.

-We will be taking the land off the property tax rolls. The Borough may be less than happy about that and it could have an impact on zoning and permit requests.

-There’s no room here for less-expensive storm water runoff solutions. We’ll probably face expensive water runoff requirements. These will probably add to land needs and certainly to construction costs.

-We may have some traffic issues with large numbers of cars entering/exiting Route 89 when we have major events. This will probably increase traffic on Pearl Street, too.

-There may be some disruption to our regular religious services while the demolition and construction are going on.

-Neighbors may not be happy with noise and traffic at evening events at the Parish Center. Will they object strenuously to the rezoning?

-Given all these issues, this site may take longer for completion than some of the others.

-Saturday evening events at the Parish Center may conflict with Mass.

-As far as visibility, it is the back of the church faces Route 89, not our ideal perspective.

-If we spread across Pearl Street we would have a city street running through our campus, with the need to handle traffic safety issues.

-The Parish Center would not be adjacent to the school; they cannot easily use the facility.

-The Parish Center is not adjacent to the cemetery for “cradle to grave” continuity.

-This site is associated with one “side” in the previous debates over a new church, and there may be negativity associated with that.

-If we stay with the current church, we forego the opportunity to expand and update it with a design for our current needs as opposed to those of the last century.

Revenue Issues

-If we can move the school here ultimately, Main Street property can be sold..

-We could sell the Brickyard property.

-No loss of income from leased land on Brickyard Road

E. Sunset Drive (Mercyhurst College)

There is a parcel of land on the northern edge of the Mercyhurst College-North East campus, along Sunset Drive between Pearl Street and Freeport Road, that includes somewhere between 12 and 16 acres. It is currently planted in grapes and the eastern edge (along Lake Street) is a storm water retention area. This would be big enough for our complex. This is also prime property for Mercyhurst since it adjoins the core of their campus.

A member of the Committee talked with Mercyhurst College-North East officials and our sense is that they’d like to partner with us since that would provide Masses for their students. It is clear that we will need to show them “what’s in it for them” if they give up some of their prime property to us. We doubt that they would simply give us the property we would need (although that would be ideal!), and we won’t have a good sense of the cost until we enter into negotiations with them about the specifics of the deal. We would not recommend this option unless Mercyhurst were willing to give or sell us the property outright; it would not be in our interests to build on a piece of land for which we only had a long-term lease, for example.

We simply have no good idea of what this property would cost us. There is a possibility that we could get it for free, but that seems unlikely. If the land were sold for residential development, it could be quite valuable. In light of this, we decided to assign a value of $10,000 per acre, resulting in a land acquisition cost of $150,000 for our cost estimates. The true cost may run from zero to $300,000 or more. We thought it more appropriate to include the $150,000 value than to leave it blank or zero. This adds an element of uncertainty to this site.

Positives

-No demolition, removal or disposal of existing buildings.

-Relatively little landfill required

-No existing buildings to bring up to code

-No zoning issues

-We can stay in our current buildings until completion if we so choose.

-There is space for expansion.

-There is visibility from Lake Street (Route 89)

-We may be able to share parking space with the college

-May be a low cost option, depending on the cost of acquiring the land.

-It is a neutral site; not involved in the past debates about the site for a new church.

-The site is connected with the Redemptorists, which fits with our history and will appeal to older members.

-It is near a vibrant college campus, which will appeal to our younger members.

-There is the potential to share resources, facilities, and personnel with the college.

-Security of the buildings may be less of an issue here.

-There is the clear opportunity to reach out to and involve the college community in parish activities.

-A change in parish identity may result from this location. This could be a positive or a negative.

-It is close to the North East public schools.

-Locating next to Mercyhurst College will give a united Catholic identity in North East.

-Association with a Catholic college may make the parish more viable in the eyes of the Diocese.

-Water and sewer lines are already available here.

-If we ultimately sell the Main Street and Pearl Street sites, that land would go back on the tax rolls of the Borough and County.

Negatives

-It is not on current parish property; we’d have to buy land or get them to give it to us.

-Ownership of the property: will Mercyhurst either give or sell us the property?

-Probably not a walkable distance for “downtown” parishioners.

-Too close to the college campus; there may be negative spillover of college activities.

-Not in the borough.

-It is not near any other parish operations: the church, the school and rectory, nor the cemetery. Until the whole campus is complete, we will have greater separation of the parish activities and buildings.

-Requires removal of current grape vines

-Is not adjacent to the cemetery and cannot allow the cradle-to-grave continuum.

-At this site we would need to manage an ongoing relationship with Mercyhurst College

-Will we surrender part of our separate identity and be linked in people’s minds with Mercyhurst?

Revenue Issues

-Main Street property can be sold eventually.

-Pearl Street property can be sold eventually.

-We could sell the Brickyard property.

-No loss of income from leased land on Brickyard Road

IX. Other Issues

A. Can We Afford This?

A key question we all have to ask ourselves is whether the parish can successfully undertake a project of this magnitude—and price tag. To help answer the latter issue, we explored the fundraising issue a bit by talking to two fundraising professionals: Susan Black-Keim, recently retired Vice President for Development at Gannon University, and Emma Lee McCloskey, President of the Diocese’s Catholic Foundation.

Susan Black-Keim retired in December 2008 from her position as Vice President for Development at Gannon University before her retirement in December. She was the person responsible for the success of their $30+ million dollar campaign. She has also worked at Penn State Erie and Allegheny College. She shared a lot of useful ideas, including the following.

We need to have a concise statement of what we’re trying to accomplish and why. Why can’t it be done with our current buildings and resources? Major donors will account for the great majority of the funds, and we need to identify prospects and be able to tell our story. The money isn’t typically raised by all parishioners donating small amounts; it’s more likely to come from a small group who are willing to make large gifts. We should start with a feasibility study including a short list of questions, and run that past a targeted group of parish leaders and potential donors, and get their input and some idea of their willingness to be involved in a major campaign. They will then help us identify other donors, who will spread the ripples even farther. The Diocese may be able to help with the procedures, but we shouldn’t count on them sharing their prospects with us. We need to coordinate within the parish, especially with the school since they are so active in fundraising and do it so well. They can help us with their expertise, and we need to avoid stepping on each others’ toes as we pursue prospects. We need to present a unified “St. Greg’s Vision” rather than competing internally. A major campaign will probably take us about 3-5 years to develop. We may choose to use outside professionals at the initial stages to get us on the right road; the Diocese should be able to help us identify good firms. We need to start by setting up a Fundraising Council for the parish to organize this effort. Get the right people and prospects on the steering committee for this project, and make sure all constituencies are represented. This will also provide us with another opportunity to pull the parish together and work toward common goals. Perhaps it would be useful to try a pilot project for the Parish Center, renting a space and putting on some of the types of functions that we expect to occur there.

Jim’s sense after talking with Susan was that raising the kind of money that we’re talking about is possible, although it will take some work and organization to make it happen.

Emma Lee McCloskey, President of the Diocese’s Catholic Foundation, to ask some of the same questions that Jim discussed with Susan. Emma Lee reiterated some of the same points that Susan had suggested, and also offered to help us in the future. She liked the idea of the Mercyhurst site, since it would allow collaboration. She lent Barb a book dealing with how to run capital campaigns. She provided information showing averages for how many gifts in various size categories are typical for reaching various campaign goals. For example, for a $2 million campaign, you’d typically have 1 gift in the $400k range, one each of $250k and $150k, 2 each in the $100k and $50k range, etc. all the way down to a large number of gifts less than $5,000 that would together amount to about $375k. Barb’s extensive packet of info also included questions that help determine if the organization is ready for a capital campaign, as well as the kind of questions the Erie Community Fund Drives Board asks of those interested in running a campaign. While we do not need to seek their approval, their framework can be useful for us as we prepare for our campaign. Like Jim, Barb’s sense at the end of their discussion was that raising the kind of money we’d need to build a Parish Center is possible for us, although it will take serious work.

B. Relationship with the School / Gym Roof Project

The Committee discussed the fact that the parish needs to put a roof on the school and gym, to the tune of over $200,000. That is a substantial sum for this parish, and it will be necessary to pay off that loan over a period of several years. Does this descent into debt necessarily pre-empt even the consideration of a major project like a Parish Center? Some parishioners have expressed the opinion that we need to pay off the whole roof debt first before we can even consider a major building project like the Parish Center.

However, this Committee sees a major need for the Parish Center, and sooner rather than later. We note that while $200,000 is certainly a considerable sum, it is rather small compared to the size of the PC project and the long-range future of the parish that we’re contemplating. Should we let this necessary $200,000 project delay or derail our bigger and longer-term plans, or might we proceed with both of them? The Committee suggests that we simply fold that $200,000 roof expense into a much larger capital campaign designed to raise enough money for it and the Parish Center. Our discussions with experienced fund-raisers tell us that, 1) it should be possible to raise the $2 to $4 million we will need for this project, and 2) that it will take a while to make it happen. We think it is necessary to continue to pay for the roof project, but to simultaneously create a plan for the longer-term capital campaign that would allow construction of the Parish Center in a couple of years. In this process of planning for our long-term future, we need to help raise the parish’s sites.

APPENDIX A

Committee Members

George Beckes (georgebeckes@yahoo.com)

George and his wife Carol have seven children and fourteen grandchildren, going onto sixteen grandchildren this August. They have been members of St. Gregory's Church for thirty one years. George has served on Parish Council, the Building Committee, is a member of the Knights of Columbus, a greeter, and a Eucharistic Minister. He graduated from Renovo, PA. High School and has an Associates Degree in Business Management from Penn State Behrend. He has held various Engineering and Management Positions throughout his working career.

Barb Bettwy (bbettwy@verizon.net)

Barb has been a member of St. Greg’s for nine years. She is a canon lawyer and serves as a Judge in the Marriage Tribunal for the Diocese of Erie. Originally from Altoona, Barb taught for 11 years in Catholic grade schools there, was the guidance counselor at the Catholic high school, and served for nine years as Director of the RCIA for the Diocese of Altoona-Johnstown. She was also a Pastoral Associate at two parishes in the Altoona area including the Cathedral. Barb holds a masters degree in Pastoral Ministry from Saint Francis University and a Licentiate in Canon Law from The Catholic University of America. Since moving to North East in 2000, Barb has coordinated St. Greg’s RCIA, served on the liturgy committee for six years, and is in her second year on Parish Council. Barb was the chairperson for last year’s parish discernment process.

Mark Blackburn (markblackburn@castleclaims.com)

Mark has been a parish member since 1988 when he moved to North East from Erie. Prior to that he was with St. Paul and St. Michael parishes in Erie. While at St. Paul’s he was a member of the Parish Council and was a basketball coach for the CYO high school. He went to grade school at St. Paul School, high school at McDowell, and graduated from Gannon University in 1980 with degrees in Management and Marketing. He has taken numerous graduate level courses in business and has numerous insurance certificates. At St. Greg’s he is a member of the Welcoming Hands Committee and a Eucharistic Minister and serves on the Parish Council. He is a Knight of Columbus having served as a deputy Grand Knight in prior years and he is a member of the K of C’s First Degree Introduction Team. He is the Owner and President of Blackburn Claims Service Inc, DBA as Castle Claims Service, which is owned by Mark and his wife. The company is an independent Insurance adjuster with offices in Pittsburgh, New Castle and North East. He has been in the insurance adjusting field with various regional insurance companies both as an independent adjuster and a staff adjuster for 28 years. He is married to Sherri and they have two children, Jessica and Angela, who are attending Mercyhurst and Thiel respectively.

Paul Komorowski (piratepaul@roadrunner.com)

Paul and his wife Carol have been members of St. Greg’s parish since 1994 when they built their home and moved to North East. His wife Carol completed RCIA in 1999. They have three children ages 12, 9, and 5 and all have been baptized at St. Gregory’s. Paul served on Parish Council for 8 years covering the transition from the Redemptorists to the Erie Diocese. Paul helped head the school siding project, served on the Long Range Planning Committee and the Building Committee. He graduated from Fairview High School and has a Bachelor of Science Degree in Business Administration from Robert Morris University. He is part owner of Seaway Window and is responsible for Sales and Marketing. He helps coach his children’s baseball, softball and hockey teams.

Jim Kurre, Chair (k12@psu.edu)

Jim has been a member of St. Greg’s parish since late 1999 when he and his wife Gail (nee McGaughey) built their home on Gulf Road on property where she was born and raised. Since then he has been a greeter, a member of the committee that brought back the Bonanza, the 2007 Long-Range Planning (later Parish Center) Committee, and the discernment process’s Communications Committee. He has been a member of the Finance Council since 2003. Jim was born and raised in Cincinnati where he attended Catholic elementary and high school. He has a BA in Economics from the University of Cincinnati, and an MA and PhD in Economics from Wayne State University in Detroit. He moved to Erie in 1977 and is an Associate Professor of Economics at Penn State Erie and Director of the Economic Research Institute of Erie. He is also a member of the comedy troupe In All Seriousness.

Joby LaFuria (lafjob@AOL.com)

Joby and her husband Russ have three grown children and four granddaughters with another one on the way. Joby has been a member of St. Gregory's for 38 years, and has served on the Parish Council, taught Faith Formation in the primary grades as well as 10th grade. She has participated in many programs, such as Renew, and Cursillo. She has been involved in the music ministry for many years in one capacity or another, and has recently been coaxed out of "guitar retirement" to play once again at the 9 AM Mass. She has been a life-long resident of North East, and graduated from NEHS. She attended Slippery Rock State College and is currently the branch manager of PNC Bank, North East Branch.

Vince Ragosta (vince.ragosta.bu2m@statefarm.com)

Vince has been a member of the parish since 1977. He and his wife raised two children in North East and have two grandchildren. Brenda is a convert, she went through RCIA at St Gregory's. Vince has been a member of choir since 1978, served on Parish Council, the Parish Building Committee, Parish Finance Council, and is a member of the Knights of Columbus. He’s originally from Mercer, attended Penn State University graduating with a BS in Humanities, spent three years in the Army with the 82nd Airborne with the rank of Spec 5. He has been an agent with State Farm Insurance since 1975, having obtained insurance designations of Chartered Life Underwriter, Chartered Financial Consultant, and the Certified Financial Planner certification.

APPENDIX B

Gym Usage

The gym in the school has been serving as our de facto parish center over the years. The Committee thought it would be useful to get an idea of how heavily the gym is used. Leslie Quigley at the school generously compiled data on usage of the gym for all of 2008 and the first half of 2009 (actual and scheduled.) During this process we discovered the following.

During 2008, the gym was used for approximately 205 events over the 366 days of the year, with multiple uses on several days. The tables below gives a breakdown of uses of the gym by type of activity and day of the week. It appears to be the case that there are often competing activities that would like to use the gym.

The table above indicates that school use accounted for about 36% of the gym activities. This includes SGS athletics, PTO activities and fundraisers, and assemblies. The “Parish” uses include Masses, Vacation Bible School, and the Parish Picnic.

The charge for rental of the gym is generally $200 for outside groups, $100 for benefits and adult parties, $75 for meetings, and $50 for children’s parties, with a cleanup fee of $100 plus $50 for use of the kitchen. There were 12 rentals in 2008, including two wedding receptions, a casino night by a non-parish group, a union meeting, five adult parties, and two children’s parties. Rentals generated approximately $1,325 in 2008.

APPENDIX C

Potential Parish Activities in New Parish Center

A. YOUTH

Carm Beardsley heads the youth effort from the Discernment process. She provided a list of nine types of activities that she would like to see take place to help involve the parish youth. They include:

1. Special teen retreats for our youth and also other teens from around the Diocese.

2. Concerts by well known Christian bands.

3. Confirmation reunions.

4. Special Bingo nights to raise money for our projects and programs.

5. Hosting special charitable events such as the 30 hour famine, inviting other Christian groups or organizations into our Parish.

6. Possibly hosting children's fairs for the younger members of our Parish and have it run by our teens.

7. Family fellowship nights where fun activities bring out the teens and their families.

8. Confirmation and Communion Celebrations - having enough room for all members of each group to be at the same Mass with any and all family members in attendance.

9. Faith Formation classes should be at the same time on the same night for 9th, 10th and 11th grade. They need to know that their faith is not limited to or concluded at the Confirmation stage. By having all the teens taught together, there may be times when we can combine classes. Right now, there is not enough space to do this unless we use the gym and it is not comfortable for those type of activities. It also does not allow privacy when needed.

She noted that most of these could be done in the current facilities, notably the gym, but on a smaller scale than she’d like. Acoustics in the current gym are not optimal, and there is no provision for privacy.

B. SCHOOL

School leaders said that they might use the Parish Center for the following activities:

1. The Auction

2. Casino Night

3. Maybe graduation (This is not a size issue; the PC would be nicer.)

4. The Craft Show

5. Pizza with Santa (About 500 come to this event, but not all at the same time.)

6. If the PC were attached to the school/gym, perhaps they could use it for a cafeteria.

7. If the PC has a stage, they could use it for shows, etc.

C. SPIRITUAL

As head of the spiritual effort from the Discernment process, Fr. David provided a list of possible uses for the PC:

1. Parish Library/reading room – kind of like the Borders book nooks – a small room with spiritual/liturgical reading and audio/visual material, plus comfortable chairs, nice environment and workdesk. Also with ability to sign out materials. Currently feasible in community room.

2. Space for Faith Formation programs. This could entail several classrooms (enough for faith formation would be enough for school) or collapsible dividers in main hall allowing it to be partitioned off. (St. Luke cafeteria renovations is a good example.) For right now, we need to restructure how Faith Formation uses the school building.

3. Small groups – Comfortable rooms for small prayer groups to meet. Only the reading area in the community room qualifies for this now.

4. Musical and theatrical productions – Stage level in main hall with backstage area plus sound system to allow for parish productions and coffee-house type events. This could also be used for speakers, day-retreats, parish mission, etc. Can be done in current church basement but not ideal.

5. Adult formation – any type of adult spiritual or catechetical event. Slight renovations to church basement and/or basement rooms at rectory would allow for this now.

6. Chapel – A small place for private prayer. We have permission for a second tabernacle from the diocese. This would provide a place of quiet and meditation open throughout the day so that we would not have to leave the church open.

7. Youth gathering space. Youth need a place they can call their own and decorate on their own. Must be large enough for activities, study area, and “flop” room, e.g., throw pillows, couches, entertainment center, etc.

8. Child care room – for larger events where child care is needed. Must include child-size furniture, books, games, etc. Current library is the closest we have now.

9. At least five office spaces – general parish, music, faith formation, pastoral and pastor. Also possibly a youth office, but that could be incorporated into the youth room above.

D. SOCIAL

Tamie Lander, as head of the Social effort from Discernment, provided the following ideas related to a social hall:

1. Parking is very limited currently at the church and school.

2. The church basement is not handicap-accessible.

3. The kitchen is too small.

4. It would be nice to have a restroom that could accommodate more than one person.

5. There are currently conflicts with school use of the gym, for the event and for setup and cleanup.

6. Acoustics in our current spaces are not as good as they might be.

E. FAITH FORMATION

Loraine Fetzer provided input from the Faith Formation perspective.

1. It would be best to have FF (at least K-9) at the same time and location. A more inviting, comfortable space would also be welcome.

2. FF needs to have an adequate office with space for a library.

3. We need to have access to technology such as DVD, projecting, internet access, etc.

4. The PC could be used for Intergenerational Events, with perhaps 200+ in attendance.

5. Retreats and social events for the kids, youth and families, and adults. First Penance, Eucharist retreats, etc.

6. Vacation Bible School could be held at the PC.

7. A commercial kitchen would allow lunches and dinners, along with fundraisers.

8. An outdoor pavilion could be useful for many parish events, too.

9. At least one meeting room, comfortably furnished for adult or youth discussion groups.

10. Ideally it would be close enough to the Church to connect events at both places.

F. The Knights of Columbus

George Beckes provided these ideas:

1. Pancake breakfast for Faith Formation

2. Three First Degree ceremonies throughout the year

3. Month meetings (to avoid problems with handicap accessibility at current facilities)

4. Hold a regional K of C meeting once a year. Not possible now.

5. Special fundraisers, perhaps Golf Raffle or Bingo.

6. Basketball free throw fundraiser.

The K of C currently does all of these except #4 in the gym or the church basement, but these are not necessarily the best locations for them.

G. WONDER WORKERS

Roseann Semelka of the Wonder Workers provided the following ideas:

1. Annual dinner (which they currently do off parish property.)

2. Spaghetti dinner

3. Funeral dinners

4. Confirmation and First Eucharist breakfasts

5. Parent/child breakfasts

6. Chinese Auction

7. Rummage Sale

She commented that they could do a lot more than they do now, if they had a facility to do it in. A Parish Center might help rejuvenate them, too.

H. CUB AND BOY SCOUTS

Jeff Stritzinger provided these ideas:

1. They have 2 5+ hour events in the gym (Blue and Gold, Pinewood Derby)

2. Monthly meetings

3. They need storage space for all the equipment they have.

4. They could do more activities if they had the space to do them.

5. They need tables and chairs to do many of their activities.

They can foresee a lot more activities if a parish hall is available.

I. GIRL SCOUTS

Activities of the Girl Scouts include dinners, lock-in, family game nights, meetings, religious awards evenings, crafts, silver and gold dinners (held at other local churches in the past), functions needing stage/music, bridging ceremonies, cookie rallies, mother-daughter breakfasts/dinners, pizza nights, harvest parties, mardi gras parties, Girl Scout Sunday fundraising events, Marian awards.

J. CHOIR

Jamie Dean provided input for the Choir:

1. REHEARSALS

Presently, rehearsals of our music groups take place either in the choir loft or the community room. The choir loft has obvious limitations, due to its inaccessibility to disabled people (narrow stairwells and several levels in the loft), its location in the main worship area (no rehearsals can be scheduled during liturgies, baptisms, wedding rehearsals, First Friday and other prayer times, etc.), and its limited space. Cantor, choir, and instrumental warmups before liturgies are somewhat hindered by our concern over interfering in some early arrivals' desire for a quiet prayer space, particularly during Saturday's rosary prayers preceding the 5:00 liturgy. The community room offers flexibility of room arrangement and proximity to my office, but the chime tables must be reset for each rehearsal and there is no kitchen to support anything beyond light refreshments. Even this room has limited accessibility, with several steps into the rectory and down to the community room.

(a) I can envision one or two of the smaller meeting rooms of a new PC being dedicated to music ministry rehearsals. The chime rehearsal setup could be somewhat permanent; and even people in wheelchairs could attend rehearsals in a fully accessible space. The music library, extra music stands, and other equipment that clutters the choir loft could be moved to a more usable space. Refreshments or even occasional meals could be offered to our loyal volunteers more conveniently in such a space.

(b) Rehearsal attendance might range from a single cantor and accompanist to a rehearsal for Christ the King Sunday of two choirs, choirchimes (20 running feet of tables), several guitars and other instrumentalists which could involve 30 people. Music ministry appreciation dinners including families could approach 100 (adult choir: 15 + youth choir: 15 + guitarists: 5 + instrumentalists and chimers: 14 + cantors: 3 + schola: 13 + family members).

(c) Adult Choir, Youth choir and Contemporary Ensemble rehearsals are weekly; Adult chimes meet weekly during certain times of the year; other instrumentalists meet occasionally. If the PC was close enough to the worship space, cantors and choirs may warm up there before each liturgy.

(d) The rehearsals are currently being held in our present facilities, as described earlier. We would do a lot more community building in a space with room to serve food more easily; I envision the adult choir having monthly snacks after rehearsal and seasonal parties for all music ministers so members can mingle with more than just their own group members. Music rehearsals may be more open to people who have trouble with stairs (although the location of music ministry in the church is still problematic).

2. FELLOWSHIP AND PARISH COMMUNITY BUILDING

(a) The Youth Choir will be presenting a special musical performance later this spring in the church. In a new Parish Center, this sort of event could be done "dinner theatre" style, or in the context of a pot luck supper, so that the parish community could gather for a meal and fellowship as well as to enjoy the performance. Even without food, a PC hall would give the flexibility to stage a nice event, with plenty of comfortable seating, without the confines of the church as theatre (moving furniture in the sanctuary, pews set in place, etc.).

(b) The full capacity of the hall might be used if the parish and larger North East community were invited.

(d) Performances can be done presently in the church, with the limitations mentioned above. The church basement has limited accessibility and a limited kitchen. The school gym, in addition to scheduling issues, has sound system problems due to its athletic function.

3. LITURGICAL EVENTS

(a) Palm Sunday Solemn Processional (depending on location of PC); retreats and evenings of reflection for liturgical ministers; Adult Ed classes on liturgy

(b) Palm Sunday could involve several hundred worshippers; classes and retreats could vary from a dozen to over 100.

(c) Classes (4-6 weekly evening sessions, offered 2-3 times a year), evenings of reflection (1 combined ministries retreat once a year; individual ministries each meet throughout the year)

(d) These activities have all been held in other places, but a new space would be more hospitable and functional and therefore may draw more participants.

K. OTHER SUGGESTIONS

1) Barb Bettwy created a list of possible activities including:

a. New member socials

b. Monthly birthday/anniversary socials

c. Funeral luncheons

d. Fair Trade Markets

e. Speaker series

f. Theology on Tap nights

g. 12-step meetings

h. Mardi Gras party

i. Prayer Shawl Ministry

j. Super Bowl Party:

k. Ministries (volunteer) appreciation dinner

l. Senior Prom (i.e., senior citizens)

m. Lenten evenings of reflection

2) Jeanne Kidder sent a list of ideas

FUNDRAISING

These would all need a large number of dedicated volunteer parishioners-to make them successful.

-High End

-Chocolate buffet & Champagne, Champagne Breakfast, or other high-end meal with substantial admission charge. Meals catered or by parish chef.

-Easter, Christmas, St. Paddy’s Day, Valentine’s Day etc. Meals catered or by parish chef.

-Cookoffs (stew, beef, chicken, turkey or vegetable stew, or other categories).

-Formal fundraiser dance and raffle

-Huge summer festival

-Other Fundraisers

-Dollar sales, basket raffles, Chinese auctions, silent auctions, dinner theatre

-Bazaar: Saturday evening, Sunday afternoon. Work around Cherry Festival and/or Parish Picnic

-Venders days eg. Mary Kay, Amway, and many others that would pay fee to reserve a table

-Antique Roadshow-type event

THEATRE: This would require a stage, with curtains and lighting

DANCES: Catered buffet dinner dances, square dancing, theme dances, ballroom dancing, social dancing, ballroom dance lessons. This also could very easily be a dance center if it has a wood floor which ballroom dancers require.

SOCIALS

-elderly

-Seasonal Socials/Parties: spring flowers, summer picnic, fall crafting, winter wonderland

-Tea / with fashion show

MOTHERS’ DISCUSSION AND PLAY GROUP with BABYSITTING

Two mothers from the group take turns caring for their children’s play group while other mothers discuss parenting, spiritual, and Catholic topics. Great way to meet other Catholic mothers and children in the parish.

Another great idea: ask each parish ministry to take a turn for one monthly activity!

-A ministry would be very busy for one month each year.

-No individual or group would constantly do all the work as it is now.

-There are so many ministries, just imagine the impact! It would involve just about every parishioner!

APPENDIX D

Information from Other Social Halls

To help give us a feel for the appropriate size of a hall, as well as the competition it will face, we contacted a number of other halls in the area. We also asked for advice as we embark on this project.

A. Social Centers and Halls

All Saints, Waterford

Their social hall was built in 2006, and is attached to their church. It accommodates about 225 comfortably, although it may be able to squeeze more. It is about 5,000 sq ft. They use their hall for social events, but also for Faith Formation. They have moveable walls that they can put up to divide it into smaller rooms. This causes conflicts since they can’t use the hall for parish breakfasts and other get-togethers after mass, since Faith Formation is using the hall. They rent their hall out, but not much. Apparently Fr. Whitman does the renting himself, and it’s a hassle, so they don’t do it much. Rent: $600+$200 if they use the kitchen. For parishioners: $150 for 2 hours + $50 each extra hour. The parish has added about 60-65 families a year since they built in 2006.

Beloved Disciple, Grove City

Although this parish is not close, it has some striking similarities to our own case. They currently use the adjoining K of C hall for their social hall events, but it is an old hall and only holds about 200, insufficient for their activities and plans. They plan to build a social hall that would accommodate 500 people for a cost of about $1.2 million on land they already own.

Blessed Sacrament, Erie (West 26th and Washington)

They do not have a separate social hall. Their website says that they rent out their cafeteria and gym.

Harborcreek Fire Hall

Built 2004 to accommodate 500 people, 10,000 sq ft (100’ x 100’). They do not perceive us to be competition. They charge $500 for four hours just for the hall. If you’re going to have food, you have to use their catering. In that case they waive the hall fee. They have been very successful with all 2009 weekends already booked, and many dates into 2010.

Holy Cross, Fairview

Social hall built 1965-66 to accommodate 500 people. It was initially profitable enough to help them pay for a new church in 1985. They rarely rent the hall now since: 1) the number of weddings has decreased significantly; and 2) they can’t compete with other facilities due to poor acoustics and lack of air conditioning. They are in the process of remodeling. They currently raise money in the social hall through parish events such as Lenten fish fries and three other dinners during the year.

Our Lady of Mercy, Harborcreek

They have a social hall that that they use for their own events, which can seat about 175, with a kitchen. They also have a gym which can handle overflow crowds, although it is not continuously connected to the social hall. Their hall was originally set up with 6 classroom for religious ed, but now is just a big open space. They used to rent it out but don’t anymore, since it was too much of a hassle. It sounds like the pastor handled the rentals, and they tried to find volunteers to handle the actual events and cleanup. It was hard to find people to do the cleanup on the time schedule that they needed, even when they were paid. There would be an event on Saturday night and the hall would need to be cleaned immediately afterwards so it could be used for Sunday morning functions. They also had conflicts with masses and faith formation. They didn’t have catering and he thought that was a problem. People had to bring their own food and liquor and try to guess how much was needed, and then were stuck with the leftovers (especially a problem with the liquor). A place like St. James can sell exactly the amount that people want. Insurance was also an issue.

Our Lady of Mount Carmel, Erie (on East Grandview near Belle Valley.)

Their social hall seats about 250-270 in a building that is also used as a gym. She wasn’t sure of the exact size or the rental price, since they just changed that. They also have a multipurpose room that handles 80-90 people. They have a lot of activities there including weddings, turkey raffles, Superbowl Sunday, golf raffle, commencement breakfast, fish dinners, various fundraisers, etc. They have a two-price structure, one price for parishioners and another for non-parishioners. She handles the catering for the hall and makes some profit on that, and turns the rest over to the parish. Their hall contributes to the parish finances, rather than requiring a subsidy.

Our Lady of Peace, Erie (West 38th and Zuck)

They do not have a separate social hall; they use their school cafeteria and gym. If they have a big dance, they’ll rent a place like Rainbow Gardens.

South Shore Inn, North East (Lake Street)

The Inn is owned by Bob Mazza, a St. Greg’s parishioner. He was very helpful in providing information and advice. His facility accommodates up to about 125 people, and we would compete with him for events of this size. He does events for various levels of customers from inexpensive to top drawer. He said that the money is in the catering rather than the hall rental, and he uses a number of different caterers. He mentioned that others in the local area who have halls are Quincy Cellars, Heritage Winery (the Gathering Place), Capers on 38th Street, and the Waterfall (although they are closed currently.)

St. James Place, Wesleyville

St. James Place was converted from a drug store. It accommodates about 500 people. They are mostly booked through their high season for this year. The parish outsources the operation of St. James Place to the people who run the Concourse at Union Station. He also handles St. Boniface and some of South Shore Inn’s functions and was interested in working with us and our Parish Center.

St. John’s, Girard

They built a huge social hall in 2000, which is listed on County property tax records as 22,256 sq ft on 5.53 acres, with an assessed value of about $1.4 million. The main hall has seating for up to 650 people in 7,000 sq ft, for which they charge $500 for 4 hrs. They have a smaller hall attached to the first that seats up to 120 in 2,000 sq ft, renting for $150 per 4 hours, and there are two smaller conference rooms (each about 450 sq ft or 21’ x 21’), renting for $75 a day. For banquets and receptions they charge by the plate for the food ($13.50 to $17 or so) and add 15% to the bill for the hall. The manager of the hall told us that they have about 70-75 rental events a year there, along with their own parish activities (bingo, basketball games, etc) We got the impression that they may be just covering their costs, but that it is not a profit center for the parish. The manager mentioned that they have a lot of overhead: cleaning, maintenance, the manager, workers for the events, etc. They made the decision to build before their school was closed, and they lost a lot of their volunteer workers (parents) when the school closed. They ran way over budget when they built, and the hall is too big for what they need now. If they had it to do over, they’d probably build smaller.

The Waterfall Restaurant, Harborcreek (Route 5)

The Waterfall is currently closed and listed for sale. It has a nice banquet hall attached.

B. Advice

1. Marty of The Concourse at Union Station: Expect the first two years to be tough, until we establish a reputation and people get to know about us.

2. Fr. Richey, Our Lady of Mercy, Harborcreek: Have a caretaker/overseer whose job it is to handle the hall and be there during events to take care of problems. Make sure you have a kitchen that’s big enough, and plenty of storage space.

3. Florence Sova, manager of the hall at Our Lady of Mr. Carmel:

-Be sure the hall has neutral colors. When they repainted their hall in the school colors they lost virtually all of their wedding business.

-Have lots of electrical outlets.

-Have a stage for bands, DJ’s, plays , etc.

-Have lots of storage for tables, chairs, etc. They own their own tables and chairs.

-Have good lighting with dimmers.

-Do not allow stags. Those lead to problems.

-It’s better if the social hall is not also the gym, since that leads to lots of conflicts.

-Have good security at the events.

-The person handling the hall has to be conscientious if this is to be successful.

-Be careful of contracting out the management/catering. If they don’t work out, you’re stuck!

-Charge extra for cleanup and have your own people do it. The people who rent the hall will not do a good enough job.

4. Fr. Mark Hoffman, Beloved Disciple (Grove City):

-He recommended planning for a complete campus, with all buildings included in the initial planning, to include enough electrical and plumbing capacity, water removal, etc. They made a mistake in not planning big enough at the beginning.

-Plan macro and build micro to start.

-He thought that starting with a social hall was a viable approach. (Our Lady of Peace, St. Jude and Holy Cross all apparently started with the social hall first.)

-It may be possible to keeps costs down by doing inside-the-parish bids for some parts of the work.

5. There is a faculty member at Mercyhurst’s main campus who designs and builds commercial kitchens, and he could give us advice on this aspect of the Parish Center.